5wt rods?

[Umhlangarox]

fast rods are more technical to cast, and this is why people overline them, because they actually cannot cast them. Overlining slows the rod down so that its easier to cast.... people who overline rods, have either bought the wrong rod, or simply cannot cast,

After all these years I now realise I can't cast, sh#t, next time I need to make sure I buy the right rod! Maybe I need to pay you a visit and you can give me some casting lessons and help educate me on line weights?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with over or underlining a rod, try it some time, you might be pleasantly surprised :tongue:

[Nepptune]

After all these years I now realise I can't cast, sh#t, next time I need to make sure I buy the right rod! Maybe I need to pay you a visit and you can give me some casting lessons and help educate me on line weights?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with over or underlining a rod, try it some time, you might be pleasantly surprised :tongue:

Shut up Matthew you've never caught a trout in your life, you shouldn't even be commenting here....

[Andre]

After all these years I now realise I can't cast, sh#t, next time I need to make sure I buy the right rod! Maybe I need to pay you a visit and you can give me some casting lessons and help educate me on line weights?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with over or underlining a rod, try it some time, you might be pleasantly surprised :tongue:

Well, answer me this then...why else would one overline the rod, if not to alter the action from what it was origionally designed for. A fast rod is designed to be a fast rod, so to change the action by overlining, changes the action... right? I know that the line weight rating of a rod is "only a guideline", but hey.... the manufacturers rating is mostly there for the purposses of getting the best performance from a rod. I have nothing against overlining, its just that I cant understand who [people buy a rod of a specific weight rating, and then use it with a different line weight...doesnt make sense to me, but yes, I do acknowledge that some people do get better performance out of a rod sometimes by overlining it, but generally it is because they are unable to cast it with the designated line weight rating. Im not saying that you unable cast in this situation, just saying that it is easier to cast a slower rod, otherwise you wouldnt overline it.

[core fly]

Andre,the reference to the TFo feeling 2 line weights heavier has nothing to do about me not being able to cast it,in fact,I cast them very well,but too me its not a great fishing rod as they tend to feel heavy and tiresome if fished the whole day.

[Andre]

Andre,the reference to the TFo feeling 2 line weights heavier has nothing to do about me not being able to cast it,in fact,I cast them very well,but too me its not a great fishing rod as they tend to feel heavy and tiresome if fished the whole day.

I realise that, I also had a 5wt TICRX once, and I really didnt like it, for the same reasons as yours, but it had one strength which was very apparent.... for full line casts and shooting line long distances with very few false casts, it was awesome and probably unrivaled in its class (with the correct line weight designation). This tells me that the rod is very good at doing only that, so casts of a shorter distance didnt feel great. Same with the Sage TCR... long full line casts with a good haul and few false casts...nothing else works for these rods. these rods cant do middle and short casts comfortably with the designated line weights, especially if the cast is even a little bit mis timed. The TICRX and the Sage TCR are quite technical rods to cast, and not for everyone. The problem with novice casters when the try to cast a fast rod that they havent quite got to grips with, is that they tend to force it, when they should actually let more line out and try slow it down a bit. One there is about half the line aerialised and the timing is good, the rest can be shot out with a haul. this is what these rods are designed for. anything more than a few false casts is going to feel heavy, and once this happens, fatigue sets in. by overlining a rod, all you are doing, to the action of a fast rod, is simulating the feel of the rod when you have most of the flyline out the tip. so....either overline the rod, or cast more line out the tip... as far as the rod is concerned, its the same thing. The problem comes in when you have overlined a fast rod, and now you need to make full line casts with the heavier line...watch it collapse... to keep the line going in these circumstance, it is even more tiring.

[Korrie]

a very fast rod has it place. i.e. in windy condtions.
It is easier to punch a heavier line into the wind, than a lighter line.
Or if you fish dams and it takes one less false cast to get the line out.
If the TCR etc where really such booming successful rods, Sage would have carried on with the manufacture of the rods or similar rods.
But it had a very short shelf life, because of bad sales.
But they where fun to cast for a while. but not great for general fishing or delicate fishing and fine tippets

[Andre]

a very fast rod has it place. i.e. in windy condtions.
It is easier to punch a heavier line into the wind, than a lighter line.
Or if you fish dams and it takes one less false cast to get the line out.
If the TCR etc where really such booming successful rods, Sage would have carried on with the manufacture of the rods or similar rods.
But it had a very short shelf life, because of bad sales.
But they where fun to cast for a while. but not great for general fishing or delicate fishing and fine tippets

I agree Korrie, there's definatly an advantage in certain circumstances to fast rods, but the wind factor can also be dealt with when fishing rods with a variety of actions. If you are fishing unto the wind, you need a shallow, or tight loop that is aerodynamic, and it isnot only fast rods that can produce this type of loop. If you are fishing from a crock on Larkies and drifting and fishing with the wind, i find that the open loop helps better, so loop formation is subjective according to what is needed. I think that the primary reason for the existence of fast rods, is to be able to cast them for long periods of time with less fatigue. Fast rods when used properly are able to cast longer lines more often, for longer periods of time with less effort. The drawback of fast rods, is that they are not as easy to cast in the hands of innexperienced caters, than their slower counterparts. Basically Im saying that its pointless for someone to try and fish a fasts rod if they dont know how to use it properly. Even in the wind, it wont help.
It was said by someone earlier, that the fast rod makes them fatigued when they cast it all day....well, i think that anything being cast all day is going to be tiring, but a fast rod, should actually be less fatiguing, if the casts are done properly. If I were going to fish in a situation where I had to make cast after cast, of full line for hours on end, I would choose a a fast or ultra fast rod, with a balanced line, and I wouldnt overline it.
Not sure I agree with the bad sales comment, because i think that fast rods are more popular than ever, and largely due to tackle dealers who sell the unsuspecting public, the wrong thing because they themselves dont understand it properly, and also because people buy rods based on a "parking lot test" , and the rods that cast best in a parking lot, are of course the fast ones. The rod buyer watches the shop assitant cast the rod a country mile, and tries it himself... he cant do it because he cant cast, so the shop assistant helps him and he gets some line out. By the time he goes fishing, he has forgotten everything, and cant get the rod working, so complains on a fly fishing forum, and someone reccommends that he overline the rod. So, he overlines it and it works better for him simply by slowing the rod down......see...wrong rod was bought in the first place.

[Circus]

Getting back to the original question about 5-weight rods.
I reckon 80% of 5-weight rods are sold to people who fish less than 20 days per year.
Shop owners give advice to those who need it: Andre doesn't want advice, but Billy-Bob is confused.
The 9’ #5 that the shop owner sells Billy will handle still-water trout, vaal yellows and isn’t a disaster for 1 day a year of river trout.
It will cast further/easier than a #4, but won’t tire him out like a #6 (he’s unfit and his casting is iffy). So Billy feels happy and will enjoy the sport more which creates repeat business.
Then, smart shop owners start threads to encourage more sophisticated anglers to get more specialised tools.

[Nepptune]

Getting back to the original question about 5-weight rods.
I reckon 80% of 5-weight rods are sold to people who fish less than 20 days per year.
Shop owners give advice to those who need it: Andre doesn't want advice, but Billy-Bob is confused.
The 9’ #5 that the shop owner sells Billy will handle still-water trout, vaal yellows and isn’t a disaster for 1 day a year of river trout.
It will cast further/easier than a #4, but won’t tire him out like a #6 (he’s unfit and his casting is iffy). So Billy feels happy and will enjoy the sport more which creates repeat business.
Then, smart shop owners start threads to encourage more sophisticated anglers to get more specialised tools.

Well played sir!

[Andre]

Getting back to the original question about 5-weight rods.
I reckon 80% of 5-weight rods are sold to people who fish less than 20 days per year.
Shop owners give advice to those who need it: Andre doesn't want advice, but Billy-Bob is confused.
The 9’ #5 that the shop owner sells Billy will handle still-water trout, vaal yellows and isn’t a disaster for 1 day a year of river trout.
It will cast further/easier than a #4, but won’t tire him out like a #6 (he’s unfit and his casting is iffy). So Billy feels happy and will enjoy the sport more which creates repeat business.
Then, smart shop owners start threads to encourage more sophisticated anglers to get more specialised tools.

Ya very much so. 5wts and 6wts are sometimes sold as something of an "all rounder". I can understand this. If it means that someone has a variety of lines, which help make the rod perform differently under different circumstances, then he is helping the rod to perform the " all rounder" role more efficiently, and this is ok because there are very few rods that are good for all things.