Is "copying" going to far????

[NeilRowe]

I thought Xplorer and Stealth were Sage copies. And Sage is a G.Loomis copy anyway. So it goes.

[Andre]

Guys, lets face facts, there is nothing on the Cumberland that other manufacturers havent done in the past. In legal terms nothing on the cumberland will be in contention to be patented. The only reason is that its just combinations of things thats already on the market. Xplorer is doing the same, but to such an extent that their final product resembles the Cumberland to such an extent that it might be seen as a copy.

Now on the Abel vs XPS-S and Clicker debate here both Abel and Sage has products that are worthy of being patented. These reels both have qualities no other reels have and both Sage and Abel probably patented their designs, Xplorer might have problems with these products. Their clicker in my book is an exact replica of the Sage (only not as well built) product and the XPS-s has a drag system that also seems like an exact replica of an Abel drag system. Not fair to both Sage and Abel and they will probably take action agains xplorer if they have patented their products and there is no roayalties paid to them by xplorer.

Please be aware that Explorer don't make anything. They buy them in from China, and have their branding put on. That goes for their rods, reels, tubes, waders, and almost everything else that carries the Explorer brand. They are a marketing company, not a design and manufacturing company. If there was any action to be taken, it would be against the manufacturer in the East.

[GrahamS]

Even from the photo you can see that the Cumberland is quite a bit better in design - just look at the seat and the pouches on the pontoons. So, like you said, if the xplorer is half the price of the Cumberland - I'll go for the Xplorer, but if there's only a R500 difference, then the Cumberland will win

If you bring it in yourself, there is only a R500 difference

[smallstreams.co.za]

Have a look on Tom's site - there is an little story about a similar issue (Chinese knock-offs) and a Ferrari. Nice reading.

[chrisvd]

Please be aware that Explorer don't make anything. They buy them in from China, and have their branding put on. That goes for their rods, reels, tubes, waders, and almost everything else that carries the Explorer brand. They are a marketing company, not a design and manufacturing company. If there was any action to be taken, it would be against the manufacturer in the East.

Andre

Even though they are just a marketing company, they probably ask the chinese company to produce items as per their requirements. If I ask an engineering company to produce something for me that I know is an exact copy of someone elses patented product both of us will be infringing the patent. In the industry I work in for example, we will be able to stop a client of a competetor from using a trailer that was suplied to him by the competetor if its a patented product.

[GrahamS]

Please be aware that Explorer don't make anything. They buy them in from China, and have their branding put on. That goes for their rods, reels, tubes, waders, and almost everything else that carries the Explorer brand. They are a marketing company, not a design and manufacturing company. If there was any action to be taken, it would be against the manufacturer in the East.

There is no copyright law in China, and counterfeiting someone's product is seen as the greatest compliment you can pay them. Strange culture.

Ja, look, I have a Cumberland, and it is light years ahead of the Xplorer in terms of design, finish, and materials. But Explorers attempt at copying the colours, the orange strip on the nose, and the 2-piece stripping apron are pretty damned lame. And sadly for them, at the price point they are offering it at, more people will just shell out for the Cumberland.

[GrahamS]

Andre

Even though they are just a marketing company, they probably ask the chinese company to produce items as per their requirements. If I ask an engineering company to produce something for me that I know is an exact copy of someone elses patented product both of us will be infringing the patent. In the industry I work in for example, we will be able to stop a client of a competetor from using a trailer that was suplied to him by the competetor if its a patented product.

It is standard practice in retail. Edgars sends their buyers on a bi-annual trip to London, Milan, and China - in that exact order. They walk around London and Milan and take pics of all the latest shoe fashions (much to the dismay of shops owners I might add). They then fly to China and sit with a design team at the factory who produces copies for their stores in SA. Same thing is rife in the golf industry.

[FishZ]

The best way to stop any behavior you do not like is to stop financially supporting that behavior. you will quickly find a correction. but the fact is most people are not sharp enough or don;t care enough to take a stand. I choose not to stock any knock offs, and that probably leads t a few less ales than i could otherwise make... but im having my say in the matter, I do not approve of shite knockoffs... period. I will not stock them to make myself extra money. we can all do the same in so many aspects of life.

[Gerrit Viljoen]

In legal terms nothing on the cumberland will be in contention to be patented.

Why not Chris? If no other manufacturer has gone the patent route I see no reason why they cannot patent various things on the tube itself not to mention the brand or name ito naming rights. Fabric spec,size,pockets,zipper function,weight,seams,dimensions,blow up foam ,ag a whole lot of things.

Have you ever wondered why Mcdonald chips are thin and a spesific length compared to Steers or KFC? These big players all have their own specs for fries and I believe McCains have to cut them chippies accordingly.I don't have exact detail but u get my drift.I can't remember the exacts but it's true.

Also, whether there are laws in China or not is irrelevant,depending on the registration of patents or copyright law and to which countries those things extend, any copy cat stand to get sued and in this case if Explorer is deemed to have bought copied goods from their chinas,the Plaintiff would probably add them as 2nd defendant.

I hope for anyones sake,the litigation if any never end up in the US cause there you pay something called punitive damages. Something we don't have here in SA and no Jury for that matter.But boy,that could top millions of $ ontop of generals and legal fees.

[Ryan]

The best way to stop any behavior you do not like is to stop financially supporting that behavior. you will quickly find a correction. but the fact is most people are not sharp enough or don;t care enough to take a stand.

The only way to beat them, is don't support them... The problem is, money doesn't grow on trees and some people don't necessarily know enough to justify the difference in cost..

As for the people doing the replicating..will I don't think it's a good thing..but you can't always reinvent the wheel and some are just in it to make money...

That's along the lines of what I said...