Favourite Smallstream Equipment

[shector]

What do you guys have in your arsenal when hunting trout in small streams?

[dpammenter]

i've only got a 3wt exploder guide series, and 2x 2/3wt exploder classic series (one custom built :D)

one day soon i'll have a CTS Vintage 0wt

[chris williams]

i've only got a 3wt exploder guide series, and 2x 2/3wt exploder classic series (one custom built :D)

one day soon i'll have a CTS Vintage 0wt

Did you build your rods in Baghdad?:p :D

My small stream jobs are old Orvis 1 and 2 weights and a lovely little Hardy midge split cane:)

[sebhersco]

3wt xplorer guide series with a lochmoor 100

[dpammenter]

Did you build your rods in Baghdad?:p :D

My small stream jobs are old Orvis 1 and 2 weights and a lovely little Hardy midge split cane:)

from every person on site, chris, you should know baghdad is bad place. rod of fly was builded on tajikistan which are known good for fishing by fly

[ShaunF]

7'6 Stealth 2 wt and an 8'0 3wt Gatti in progress.

[sebhersco]

when i'm no longer a student and hopefully making decent money i'll treat myself

[harry]

My favourite is a little 6'6" 3wt cane rod loaded with 3wt DT Cortland 444 floater. It does everything right for me. I also have a 7'10" 2wt Orvis that I use very infrequently, as well as a 7' 3wt St Croix, amongst others.

[shector]

Chris
The Orvis Superfine 1wt has a fairly slow action, when you first got it did you have to adjust your casting stroke much? And how quickly does it load?

[Chris Shelton]

when you get to Chris's age, i think you become naturally adapted to the pendulum stroke :D

[shector]

A few months ago I purchased the Vision 6'6 2wt overlined with a Hardy 3wt line, awesome rod. It puts the fly exactly where I want it. I also get a fair bit of distance with when I need to.
I'm thinking a buying a Rio Ridge 2wt line for delicacy in case I need it (low water conditions).

[chris williams]

Speak up, young man, I can't hear you??

Shector
Orvis Superfine 1 wt and 2 wt - I got each of the two when they were first produced. I think the 2 wt I got about 1984 or somewhere round there, and the 1 wt I think a few years after that - but going w-a-y back in time! Yes they're both what I guess you'd call middle action and are lovely for close-range small dries and small nymphing. As to casting I try and be gentle (I tell all the purple-rinse grannies the same thing!:D ) - no need to double-haul and rip my shoulder-muscles or what's left of them!
Good luck with your new rod!:)

[Chris Shelton]

My TFO 2wt 7'3" 4pc 'Lefty Kreh' Finesse Series. She is a real little sweet peach of a rod!

[ShaunF]

I'm thinking a buying a Rio Ridge 2wt line for

I think Dave Levine's eyes would roll back in his head and he'd start projectile vomiting if he read this ! :eek: :D

[chris williams]

from every person on site, chris, you should know baghdad is bad place. rod of fly was builded on tajikistan which are known good for fishing by fly
Tajikistan full of Satan peoples with hairy fishless daughters. Fat womans you think pregnant have exploders under black dresses and blow-up like mincemeats in market place. Better make rod in beautiful Kazakhstan on roadside stall owned by my handsome and brainlike cousin. Good fishings with unexploader experiences!

[FishWhisperer]

Stealth Travel 2/3# with an Ultralight (dont laugh Im a student :D), filled with some line that came from a box with a Greyling on it... cant remember what brand it was, not one of the usual (but really good stuff, probably the best Ive used!! :)) Its my baby and i love it!!! Tried a Orvis 1 ounce which was nice but i do prefer my rod. Its faster! :)
Soon to build a Sage 00# !! :D

[Chris Shelton]

825

Here are some other sentimental and useful gadgets (some of them not put to use much anymore, but good companions never the less) that I found in my fly vest :)

[harry]

Yep, essential equipment. A man may die of thirst at any moment, being exposed to the elements and all. Wonder what variation of spey casting is illustrated on your container of he Water of Life.

[FishWhisperer]

Sorry quick question: what is that river called that runs past the old Dewdale??

[Chris Shelton]

Sorry quick question: what is that river called that runs past the old Dewdale??

The Berg River

[Chris Shelton]

Yep, essential equipment. A man may die of thirst at any moment, being exposed to the elements and all. Wonder what variation of spey casting is illustrated on your container of he Water of Life.

You are obviously a man for detail Harry :D I have never thought about it actually, but now that you mention it, it looks something like those Tongariro River Roll casts that Kevin Elliot introduced us to a while back :)

[izak]

Vision 3-Zone 3# rod, Stealth 3/4 reel, Vision line. I love them and they do the job beautifully.

Special mention has to go to my Hi-Tech boots, and not sure what its called, but the thing that you clip on that has the retractable cable that you put a nail clipper on. Priceless piece of equipment.

I have a very simple but effective setup, a small backpack for stuff like water, food, sunscreen etc. Then I have a moon-bag with my flies and tippet line. Quick, easy access to what is important.

[LeRoy]

I was in St.5 in 1997. By this time I was thoroughly addicted, having been using my buddies' rods for a year or two already. I got desperate for my own rod, and started delivering the Argus for R30 a week, in order to save for it. I was eyeing a Pflueger Summit for a while, but when I saw the (original cheap) Stealth 7'6 2/3# I knew I had found my rod. I would have to be patient for the extra few weeks it would take me to round up the necessary R320, but the salesbloke offered to keep it for me until that time. I was beyond myself when the day finally came, and now ready for the small challenge of saving for the Lochmor 100 that was to be my reel. Well, long story short, a further few weeks later I was kitted and ready to fish my Stealth with its Lochmor reel and Airflo line. I headed out to a secret lttle stream in Stellenbosch (not the Eerste) and caught my first of a whole three wild trout I have ever caught. It took a sunken Adams on a non drag free drift, and measured a monstous three inches. Hearing this, my best bud got jealous and had mommy buy him a Sage. Gmph. Anyway, that's just the first of many awesome memories my trusty 3# and me made. It became one of the most dangerous bass bashing tools in the Southern Cape. Even though only half of it is left, (in other words I am the proud owner of the world's first three weight shooting head) I have never even replaced the line, and the ten or so metres that's left still works fine. (What will mister Levine say about that?)
This year however, disaster struck. On my recent trip back to Stellies, I thought I'd go give my little rod a workout on some Jonkershoek trout. I released my first trout for the day and turned around to pick up the rod and cast again, only to find that I'd whipped my babe around the ankles with it, and the tip was gone. So I bought my most beloved fly rod in Stellenbosch, only to take it back for a tenth anniversary trip down memory lane, and break it. Philip(Fish) and Ryan (from Jonkershoek) can vouch for the fact that my panic was great. Philip reckons the rod can be fixed, though, and I believe him, but I've a feeling it will never be the same. I have through the years expanded my gear, but my little old Stealth was My Rod, and my heart is broken. I have just started making peace with it, and have temporarily put thoughts of replacing it with the beautiful Stealth Travel 2/3 hanging in Philip's shop out of my mind. And now you guys just had to bring it back up. Thank you very much.

P.S. What is you guys' opinion on what I should do to fix my rod, and what is the potential effect? Will it still be a three weight, having lost about ten cm off the top?

P.P.S. Can you believe the length I manage to give my posts? I mean seriously, I can't seem to help it. I apologise if you just waded through this lengthy lament, and found absolutely nothing of interrest therein. I kindly remind you that at least once, you must have had a rod that was a part of your heart- a union that is painful to break. Maybe you wouldn't mind sharing your story too? Cheers..

[shector]

Chris Shelton
Billie De Jongh bought a TFO Finesse 2wt and I spoke to Leonard Flemming about that rod before purchasing the Vision 2wt. He maintains that the rod is a little flimsy and doesn't have enough punch.
I on the other hand have had a ago with this rod at Flywaters and to me the rod has a sweet casting stroke.
How do you rate it?

[Chris Shelton]

[QUOTE=LeRoy;27528]
P.S. What is you guys' opinion on what I should do to fix my rod, and what is the potential effect? Will it still be a three weight, having lost about ten cm off the top? QUOTE]

If you still have the tip piece, it can be fixed. Get in touch with Neil Rowe and he'll tell you how.

[LeRoy]

I'll do that, thank you Chris!

[shector]

LeRoy
I'm based in Stellies. What stream are you referring? The Blaauklippen?

[shector]

A while ago I was thinking of purchasing a Sage 00. I haven't ruled out the idea of owning one. Do any of you know where I can get it for a decent price?

[Chris Shelton]

Chris Shelton
Billie De Jongh bought a TFO Finesse 2wt and I spoke to Leonard Flemming about that rod before purchasing the Vision 2wt. He maintains that the rod is a little flimsy and doesn't have enough punch.
I on the other hand have had a ago with this rod at Flywaters and to me the rod has a sweet casting stroke.
How do you rate it?

I rate it number 1 in my arsenol of rods!!! I absolutely love the rod!........and it is definitely not too flimsy,... nor too powerful. It is absolutely perfect for our streams! I am not just saying this because it is all I could afford and want to make it sound great either. I have R15 000.00 worth of Sage rods sitting in my cupboard at home, gathering dust and cobwebs since purchasing the little TFO.

[FishWhisperer]

P.P.S. Can you believe the length I manage to give my posts? I mean seriously, I can't seem to help it. I apologise if you just waded through this lengthy lament, and found absolutely nothing of interrest therein. I kindly remind you that at least once, you must have had a rod that was a part of your heart- a union that is painful to break. Maybe you wouldn't mind sharing your story too? Cheers..

Hahah - funny. It put a smile on my face.
My first rod was a Pflueger Summit! :rolleyes: I still got it although it suffered the same fate as your beloved Stealth. I just stuck an eye in the top and hey presto! Its doesn't feel the same though... but when im in a tight spot my 6'3" gets it done:D

[FishWhisperer]

A while ago I was thinking of purchasing a Sage 00. I haven't ruled out the idea of owning one. Do any of you know where I can get it for a decent price?

Ill build one for you :D Cheap Cheap!!

[izak]

P.P.S. Can you believe the length I manage to give my posts? I mean seriously, I can't seem to help it. I apologise if you just waded through this lengthy lament, and found absolutely nothing of interrest therein. I kindly remind you that at least once, you must have had a rod that was a part of your heart- a union that is painful to break. Maybe you wouldn't mind sharing your story too? Cheers..

Cool story. :D

My fisrt rod was an explorer classic 6#. It will always have special meaning to me and I still use it. A true multipurpose rod: salt, still, stream. Its my only rod that I have not broken!

[shector]

Fish Whisperer
How cheap is cheap cheap? And what would happen in the effect of rod or tip breakage?

[shector]

Chris Shelton
I definitely like the TFO 2wt. I contemplated getting it for a long time and I would still get it, but at the moment I'm accumulating alot of 2wt rods.
I guess its just a case of different strokes for different folks! I think Leonard made the assessment on the Witels where he wanted to achieve longer casts to reach the heads of some of the longer pools.
I'm interested to know how the presentation is for the TFO 2wt (for future reference)?

[Chris Shelton]

My 000 Sage cost about R3500.00 in materials alone, and that was with the cheaper cork reel seat.

[shector]

Chris Williams
The reason I'm interested, i've always been intrigued by the Superfine series from Orvis, especially the 1wt, one ounce and the Ultrafine. I know the technology is a bit dated, but would like to own all of them just to have a piece of history.

[rols]

I rate it number 1 in my arsenol of rods!!! I absolutely love the rod!........and it is definitely not too flimsy,... nor too powerful. It is absolutely perfect for our streams! I am not just saying this because it is all I could afford and want to make it sound great either. I have R15 000.00 worth of Sage rods sitting in my cupboard at home, gathering dust and cobwebs since purchasing the little TFO.
I'm very good at dusting off Sage rods...nudge nudge

[Chris Shelton]

Chris Shelton
I definitely like the TFO 2wt. I contemplated getting it for a long time and I would still get it, but at the moment I'm accumulating alot of 2wt rods.
I guess its just a case of different strokes for different folks! I think Leonard made the assessment on the Witels where he wanted to achieve longer casts to reach the heads of some of the longer pools.
I'm interested to know how the presentation is for the TFO 2wt (for future reference)?

It is a medium actioned rod, which presents beautifully. The kind of rod that Leonard uses to reach the top of those longer Witels pools would definitely not present as delicately as the Finesse. Something has to give. Distance casting should never be the main criteria for choosing a rod for the stream anyway.

[shector]

Chris Shelton
I first spoke to Sean Mills about adding a cork reel seat to the Sage 00, when it first made its appearance in 2004. I would prefer the cork instead of the wood.
What are the limitations of the Sage 00 and 000? I'm concerned about the elements reeking havoc with the rod during a day out on the Smallies.

[shector]

I guess the TFO 2wt says it all in its name FINESSE! Thanks for the info Chris. Much appreciated!

[Chris Shelton]

[QUOTE=shector;27553 Ultrafine .[/QUOTE]

Now there is a soft rod for you.........One can't cast very far with it at all, but what a lovely presenter of the fly it is! I fished with one for 3 seasons and loved it.

[chris williams]

Stealth Travel 2/3# with an Ultralight (dont laugh Im a student :D), filled with some line that came from a box with a Greyling on it... cant remember what brand it was, not one of the usual (but really good stuff, probably the best Ive used!! :)) Its my baby and i love it!!! Tried a Orvis 1 ounce which was nice but i do prefer my rod. Its faster! :)
Soon to build a Sage 00# !! :D

Yep I know what you mean but for close range I prefer the slower action rods, there's more 'feel' - but I was brought up (not from my father's mouth I'm glad to report) from the ol' split cane brigade and the ol' Orvis jobs have a quicker, but not too dissimilar action, especially compared with the modern hi-techno cast-40-metre longer jobs

[Chris Shelton]

Chris Shelton
I first spoke to Sean Mills about adding a cork reel seat to the Sage 00, when it first made its appearance in 2004. I would prefer the cork instead of the wood.
What are the limitations of the Sage 00 and 000? I'm concerned about the elements reeking havoc with the rod during a day out on the Smallies.

Obviously wind is a factor to be considered when fishing the 000 but then again, I would not take a 00 out either on a gusty day. Personally I think people are making too much of the 'going light' thing. It is actually starting to become ridiculous and quite irritating actually. Going lighter is definitely not the better choice...and more often than not it is the worst choice on our Cape streams. If you have a 2# that does the job for you, stick with it. You won't get any more enjoyment out of a lighter rod than that. I speak from my own experiences and others may disagree, and they are entitled to their opinions on the matter, but I am sticking with mine.

[Michael]

Rods:
3wt Horison TRS, 8' - Excellent little rod
3wt Albright A-5, 7'6", 5 piece (my new favourite)
2wt Elkhorn Traveller, 6'. 4-pce rod (Small stream, tight casting gem)
Reels:
Elkhorn MA-0.5 (2/3/4 wt)
Elkhorn T1 (2/3/4 wt)

[chris williams]

Obviously wind is a factor to be considered when fishing the 000 but then again, I would not take a 00 out either on a gusty day. Personally I think people are making too much of the 'going light' thing. It is actually starting to become ridiculous and quite irritating actually. Going lighter is definitely not the better choice...and more often than not it is very often a worse choice on our Cape streams. If you have a 2# that does the job for you, stick with it. You won't get any more enjoyment out of a lighter rod than that. I speak from my own experiences and others may disagree, and they are entitled to their opinions on the matter, but I am sticking with mine.

Hear, hear, and you name's not even EH (I didn't fall into the CPS namesdropping trap!):D :)

[shector]

Chris Shelton
What made you sell or get rid of it? I enquired about that rod along time ago at the then Ultimate Angling and spoke to John Yelland, he suggested that i rather try the One Ounce (which he had at the time). Never purchased either. I bought a Stealth Xtreme 2wt (served my pocket better being a student and all) and it served me very well for 6 seasons. I've since given it to my girlfriend.
I see on the CPS website under the classifieds someone wants to sell his Ultrafine for R1800.00.
Do you think its reasonable?

[Michael]

Obviously wind is a factor to be considered when fishing the 000 but then again, I would not take a 00 out either on a gusty day. Personally I think people are making too much of the 'going light' thing. It is actually starting to become ridiculous and quite irritating actually. Going lighter is definitely not the better choice...and more often than not it is the worst choice on our Cape streams. If you have a 2# that does the job for you, stick with it. You won't get any more enjoyment out of a lighter rod than that. I speak from my own experiences and others may disagree, and they are entitled to their opinions on the matter, but I am sticking with mine.

Chris, I agree. There is no reason to go lighter than 2wt, in my opinion. It's silly actually...a gust of wind starts blowing, and now you battle to cast. You catch a fish bigger than 500g, and it starts becoming unfair to the fish (you want to land it as quick as possible and release it as quick as possible).
There's no line really suited to a 00 or 000 anyway. The whole "let's go 00 and 000 and 00000000 rods" is over-rated.

[chris williams]

825

Here are some other sentimental and useful gadgets (some of them not put to use much anymore, but good companions never the less) that I found in my fly vest :)

All I can see is a rather beautiful-looking battered pewter liquid-holding object- - but there again, to the jaundiced eye, all is yellow

[shector]

Chris Shelton
Sean Mills seems to share the same sentiment regarding lighter rods. He says that it all depends on personal preference and you can get away with alot using a 2wt properly (playing with diffrent leader lengths and so forth). Personally, i've always preferred 2wts. I would just like to own a Sage 00 or 000 or even a Superfine 1wt for those days on the Elandspad where low water conditions reign supreme.

[dpammenter]

agreed, Chris. i don't see the absolute NEED for anything below a 2wt ... but i really WANT a 0wt. i wouldn't go lighter than that. i think it's just a personal thing; i've always had an itch to own a very small (6'6") light weight fly rod. there is no legitimate reason cos i think my 3wt is great, but i just want one!

[shector]

Since the Vision 6'6 2wt, I've since added a Vision 3wt to my collection. And it rates as well as the 2wt. The weight of the 3wt with wooden reel seat weighs lighter than my old Stealth Xtreme 2wt with cork insert!

Next on my list Vision GT 2-4wt reel. Put in the order thtough Saen Mills a few weeks ago

[LeRoy]

LeRoy
I'm based in Stellies. What stream are you referring? The Blaauklippen?

Hi there, Stanton. I wasn't planning on giving any clues other than maybe looking for some blue rocks. You got me, man. I miss Stellenbosch, hey. Judging by the way the Eerste looks these days (bloody overgrown, man! Didn't look anything like that when I still lived there. First reports of bass in the river started coming through, though. They still there?) I'd be lank surprised if there still are any trout in the Blaauwklippen, though. So are they? That must be the skinniest trout stream in the world. I got to fish it twice and suddenly found myself living in George..

[shector]

I share the same sentiment, I just want them all!

[Chris Shelton]

Chris, I agree. There is no reason to go lighter than 2wt, in my opinion. It's silly actually...a gust of wind starts blowing, and now you battle to cast. You catch a fish bigger than 500g, and it starts becoming unfair to the fish (you want to land it as quick as possible and release it as quick as possible).
There's no line really suited to a 00 or 000 anyway. The whole "let's go 00 and 000 and 00000000 rods" is over-rated.

I agree. I think we have reached the turn around in lightness a long time ago. The top manufacturers are now pushing beyond the boundaries in my opinion. Now that we have everything from a 000# upwards, surely we as anglers have enough of a choice to make up our own minds now? We don't need over jealous manufacturers to try and convince us that the next even lighter rod is going to be better than the previous. How many more chances do they want to prove themselves? Yet still, we fall for it everytime. Another thing, what becomes of their 1 and 2wt rods now that they are into the sub 0 thing? How many rods do they actually want us to have? The answer is obviously ALL OF THEM. It really is becoming a joke.

[chris williams]

As I think I've mentioned before, I've caught (by accident) an approx 20lb carp on Lake Hume in Oz on my Orvis 1wt with a size 16 PTN when I was fishing in the margins for baby browns, and luckily I had enough thin backing to bring the Mother in - about an hour later...however the 2wt Orvis S'fine being I think from memory about a foot longer gives that much more control. I certainly havn't yet been beaten on a small stream by any trout or yellow TO DATE (famous last words!!!!) on a 2 wt Orvis S'fine, and find both 1 and 2 wts have enough sensitivity for my needs and I don't need anything lighter. Like most of you say I rather kit out the weight rod to suit the size/bushiness of fly, wind, other conditions such as distance I need to cast, distance at which I need control, prevailing at the time, rather than the size of fish expected. I catch FA anyway so that's the least of my worries...My Hardy light split-cane jobbie I'm too s-scared to use unless I've been off the turps for a day or two so I havn't used it in quite a while...

[shector]

The Blaauklippen still has trout, very small and higher up though. A friend of mine took his kid up there and caught trout. He says they have this gold tinge to them. I'm definitely fishing it next season, checking out approach first. Most of the stream where the vegetation starts becoming fynbos is on private land. Still figuring out an avenue to get there!

[Chris Shelton]

:D
Chris Shelton
What made you sell or get rid of it? I enquired about that rod along time ago at the then Ultimate Angling and spoke to John Yelland, he suggested that i rather try the One Ounce (which he had at the time). Never purchased either. I bought a Stealth Xtreme 2wt (served my pocket better being a student and all) and it served me very well for 6 seasons. I've since given it to my girlfriend.
I see on the CPS website under the classifieds someone wants to sell his Ultrafine for R1800.00.
Do you think its reasonable?

I gave it to a good friend. I had just purchased my Sage LL and I knew that he needed a rod like that more than I did. The rod is about 15 years old now and my mate still uses it on the small streams of the Cape.....and absolutely loves it! The Orvis Ultrafine will go down as one of the true classics. If you can ever get your hands on one, grab it. They cost R1500 15 years ago....so make up your own mind on that Boet! :D

[chris williams]

The Blaauklippen still has trout, very small and higher up though. A friend of mine took his kid up there and caught trout. He says they have this gold tinge to them. I'm definitely fishing it next season, checking out approach first. Most of the stream where the vegetation starts becoming fynbos is on private land. Still figuring out an avenue to get there!
Sounds wonderful - father and son - what it's all about a la Rabbi.:) My jaundiced eye being yellow, will it make the trout even more gold?:D

[LeRoy]

The Blaauklippen still has trout, very small and higher up though. A friend of mine took his kid up there and caught trout. He says they have this gold tinge to them. I'm definitely fishing it next season, checking out approach first. Most of the stream where the vegetation starts becoming fynbos is on private land. Still figuring out an avenue to get there!

That's good to know. There's a little bridge over it just outside Paradyskloof (I think, it's a bit vague, but it was definately not high up the stream..) where I locked up my bike, and hopped down to the stream and started fishing. I got two right there. To me, at that moment they were the most beautiful fish in the world. It's true about the golden tinge, as I recall, and they still had very dark parr marks. I headed upstream, clueless as to whether I'm on private land or not, and fished until the bushes got too thick to cast. Good times, man, good times..

[LeRoy]

Sounds wonderful - father and son - what it's all about a la Rabbi.:) My jaundiced eye being yellow, will it make the trout even more gold?:D

You might even be fooled into thinking that you have in your hands a brown..

[shector]

LeRoy
How far in paradyskloof was this, ie what road did you take to get there?
My buddy says there's a junction waterfall pool way up in the mountains where three streams cascade into it. Definitely gonna have to check it out!!

[chris williams]

Nice one!:) On second thoughts I'd rather not 'visualise' it!:D

[LeRoy]

LeRoy
How far in paradyskloof was this, ie what road did you take to get there?
My buddy says there's a junction waterfall pool way up in the mountains where three streams cascade into it. Definitely gonna have to check it out!!

Stanton
I'm gonna have to check that out. As I said it's all a bit vague these days. I am damn near willing to bet that I took the Blaauwklippen road, though..?:D As I remember you basically drive past Paradyskloof on a long straight road that eventually runs parallel to the stream. A little road or farm entrance turns off it to the right and crosses the stream. That's the wee bridge I refer to, and I can swear the long road was Die Blaauwklippen Pad. But I'm not sure, you'll have to go look for it.;) A little ways upstream from the bridge, there's a little weir with a little pool below it. Got my last one in there. Bit bigger than the other two, but still, as you can gather, everything in, of and about the Blaauwklippen is little. If there are still trout in that little section, somebody's been looking after them..

[LeRoy]

Nice one!:) On second thoughts I'd rather not 'visualise' it!:D

Indeed, maybe best not to! You might just get some in your jaundiced eye..;) :D

[dlampert]

Chris Shelton
I definitely like the TFO 2wt. I contemplated getting it for a long time and I would still get it, but at the moment I'm accumulating alot of 2wt rods.
I guess its just a case of different strokes for different folks! I think Leonard made the assessment on the Witels where he wanted to achieve longer casts to reach the heads of some of the longer pools.
I'm interested to know how the presentation is for the TFO 2wt (for future reference)?

Shector,

I got the TFO 2wt Finesse from Eddie Gerber a couple of years ago when I was looking for a light rod. I fished it over a period of a couple of months and didn't like it at all - it was far too soft for my casting style and I found that it "collapsed" when trying to punch a cast into the wind. Kevin Cox tried it one day with me and if I recall correctly he didn't like it either. I am not saying the rod is bad, it just doesn't suite my casting style. I thanked Eddie and gave it back to him. My suggestion is to go and cast it and see if it suits your casting style.

I have a couple of light rods:

Ecotec Titan 9' 3wt
Ecotec Titan 8'6" 3wt
Ecotec Titan 8' 3wt
Ecotec Titan 7'6" 2wt
Ecotec Titan 7'6" 1wt
Ecotec RiverRun 7'6" 3wt
Horizon 8' TRS 3wt
Vision Midge 6'6" 2wt
Sage 7'9" 000wt

I may have left out one or two. My normal stream rod is my 8'6" Ecotec Titanium 3wt which I love. The Sage 000wt is a beautiful little rod if fished in the right conditions and on the right water. It presents soft as a feather and when fishing small streams where avg trout are 4 - 6 inches and a trophy is 9 inches I don't think you could find a better rod. For late season fishing where the water is very low and clear and the fish are spooky this little rod excels. Having said that I have caught up to 16" fish with it and managed to land them quickly although the rod will bend double :D Mario has caught larger fish on his Sage 00wt and landed them without a problem. I guess you either like this kind of fishing or you don't - I do.

Regards,
Darryl

[chris williams]

Indeed, maybe best not to! You might just get some in your jaundiced eye..;) :D
Touche!:D :D (Can't put acute accents on e's can we?)

[LeRoy]

Touche!:D :D (Can't put acute accents on e's can we?)

Alt 130. é, yip, works. Cheers!

[Chris Shelton]

All I can say is, different strokes for different folks and to each their own. I am not a multi-rig stream fisherman, predominantly fishing the dry fly. My fishing is often on the move, covering water quickly with short pinpoint casts as I go. The TFO Finesse 2# does the job perfectly for me in that it loads quickly for the really close quarter stuff, and packs more than enough punch for the odd distance cast. I am yet to try it with droppers and things, but I don't see the need. Firstly, why make it do something it is not designed for, and secondly I don't enjoy that kind of fishing anyway.

I have fished often enough with Neil Rowe for him to bear me up on how impressively this rod performs with the dry fly. He sure has commented on it often enough.

As Darryl said, not all rods are going to suit every style. The very attributes that someone like Darryl for example would be looking for in a rod, are the very things that could possibly hamper my particular style, and vice versa I am sure. So, in conclusion, you can read reviews and comments, but ultimately YOU need to try a rod out to see if it suits YOUR particular style of fishing.

[Andre]

When you say "small streams" you are actually covering quite a few possibilities, therefore I use the following depending on stream and conditions:-

Sage TXL 000 with Abel Tr light ( haven't actually used the rod yet)
Sage TXL2wt with Sage 3100 , awesome for most Cape Streams
Sage Z-Axiz 3wt with Sage 3200 , my favorite all round rig for Cape Streams and even better for Rhodes.

I think I have what will suffice for most small streams for single or tandem rigs, fast, slow water, wind, and usefull for technical work as well

[fish]

Eish wena,

You guys fish too much light, what about casting a longer light leader with a bit heavier/longer rod? The heavier fly line will fall further away from the spooky fish. If the wind starts to howl there is no need for a different rod, if a tungsten bead is needed on a 12ft. leader there is no need for a heavier rod. 4wt 8' sounds like a good proposition.

Cheers,

Philip

[gkieser]

May current favourite is a T&T LPS 9'0" 3wt. It has a medium action and for me that's the business on our little streams. It's still pretty new but I've taken to it quickly and it beats the pants off any other rod i have fished so far. Depending on conditions and how i plan to fish, I may change between a Sage Quiet Taper DT 3, Cortland 444 WF3, or Rio Pocketwater PW3.

I have two leader systems that I copied from MC's article in the piscator that i use and I feel these are very important pieces of equipment on the streams. The one is a very long leader built to his specs (I think it's the medium river) which is perfect for dry fly fishing. When fishing tandem rigs I have modified one of the formulas to have a more drastic taper and it helps casting two flies without hampering presentation too much.

My reels that hold the above lines, (although to me not very important equipment) are a Hardy Marksman 2/3wt and a Stealth Cassette with spare spool.

I also have the following smallstream rods:
Ecotek Titan 1wt 7'6
Ecotek Titan 2wt 7'6 *2
Ecotek River run 7'6"

The 1wt is a sweet little rod which I pair with a Wulff TT2 - an excellent combo for dry fly but doesn't handle tandems. I find the 1wt to be a little bit too limiting in all fishing conditions. My favourite rod used to be the 2wt Titan but from the beginning of this past season i started feeling like it was too much like a pool queue and so I switched back to the River run 3wt which has a softer action (although still med-fast) and this felt more natural to me. I then casted one of Darryl's rods which he forgot to mention, and Orvis (not sure which) that was rated medium and that sold me and I bought the Medium rated T&T LPS and the other rods have since been totally neglected.

As for length, the current trends seem to be leaning towards longer rods and I can definately see the benefit of them, although I am yet to take my LPS onto the holsloot. I might just have to get a shorty like the Hardy Marksman for that, or the TFO Finesse. I'm surprised to hear Kevin doesn't like this rod as I thought the (rated) action would be just up his street.

[Chris Shelton]

[LIST=1]
the TFO Finesse. I'm surprised to hear Kevin doesn't like this rod as I thought the (rated) action would be just up his street.

It really surprises me too. I would love to hear Kevin's comments on this.

Darryl, I cant quite agree with your comment on the TFO collapsing, because I have never found this myself. Our styles are obviously vastly different! As far as punching a fly into the wind is concerned, the secret with this rod is not to punch too hard. Same applies to the 000. The harder you punch, the more the loop opens up. All i can say is, I have never found the TFO 2wt 7'3" Lefty Kreh Finesse Series wanting on the stream ever. If I were to choose one rod for all my stream fishing, it would still be my Sage 7'9" 3wt LL, but the TFO comes a very close second.

[gkieser]

DAMMIT!!! The way you were talking about the finesse, i thought that LL might be coming up for sale!

[Andre]

Eish wena,

You guys fish too much light, what about casting a longer light leader with a bit heavier/longer rod? The heavier fly line will fall further away from the spooky fish. If the wind starts to howl there is no need for a different rod, if a tungsten bead is needed on a 12ft. leader there is no need for a heavier rod. 4wt 8' sounds like a good proposition.

Cheers,

Philip
No Philip, I am not saying that I change to a different rod everytime the wind blows, just that if it is a windy day, I won't take out the triplet. I never go onto the streams with more than one rod. Your suggestion about the longer leader hold merit, but I would do this anyway with the 2 or 3 wt. Oh.., and another thing, small beaded nymphs are nothing for the 2 or 3 wt Sages, so the difference to the 4 wt like you suggest, will be a matter of personal choice. If you are talking longer casts as well, the Z-Axis could probably cast to the end of the beat anyway, so it not a castability issue either, but rather a line control issue which would be seriously influenced by the length of the rod, ie ability to get longer drag free drifts. I won't argue with you too much because I know your skill level and you definatly are worth listening to, so I will reserve final final judgment until I see you fish the streams with the 4wt, but for me, way too heavy.

[fish]

Admittedly a 000 ought must be an awesome rod to catch fish with, it is a fun rod to cast, light in hand and very delicate in presentation. I just can't see the practical application of these ultra light rods. A bit heavier rod 3-4wt. can cast a longer leader under general fishing conditions, can punch a shorter leader into a stiff breeze (when leader length needs to be adjusted). The 4wt. is a slower action rod, for me it is just the fact that I can present 6 or 7x from a greater distance than a lighter rod, with the rod still slow enough to fish short range.

Andre, after casting your Z axis at Lakies I have to admit that these rods become part of you while casting, awesome tools, I just don't always agree with the average South African stream fisherman being a ultra light weight fanatic.

Cheers,

Philip

[Chris Shelton]

DAMMIT!!! The way you were talking about the finesse, i thought that LL might be coming up for sale!

hehe...Hey Grant, I am surprised you havent homed in on my triple? :)

I was speaking to Neil about it earlier actually. In hindsight, I guess I haven't been fair on the rod. The triple is a real specialist rod designed for very specific conditions, and on the day when the perfect conditions prevail, there can be little to beat a little magic wand like this. I have enjoyed a few days like that this past season where I was thoroughly delighted with the rod.....but there were also some days where I became frustrated when the wind picked up a bit, and I found myself wishing that I had packed my heavier rod in. So, the moral of the story is, never venture to distant waters with just the triple in your trunk, always pack your heavier rod in as a back up. One never quite knows what the conditions will be like until you actually arrive at your fishing spot, and even then it can change.

[gkieser]

Ja like some guys have already mentioned I haven't really got into the light wand mentality yet, so it's safe for now. I went down to 1wt and then came back up to 3wt. As always, personal preference dictates.

Can I have first refusal on your LL though? *bats eyelids*??

[Chris Shelton]

Ja like some guys have already mentioned I haven't really got into the light wand mentality yet, so it's safe for now. I went down to 1wt and then came back up to 3wt. As always, personal preference dictates.

Can I have first refusal on your LL though? *bats eyelids*??

NO, YOU CANT HAVE MY LL!!! There's your first refusal...happy now? :D ;)

[gkieser]

hehehe. thats all i wanted...

[Stephen Louw]

I use and really enjoy an 8"6' T&T LPS in a 3 weight. I would like to get a shorter 2 weight, and am curious to try the new Hardy Marksman. I tried the Marksman 9" 5 weight this afternoon, and it is a magnificant rod, but not quite the action I am looking for in that weight. For a smaller stream rod, the Marksman 2 weight should be just perfect.
Alternatively, I could always dream of owning a Tom Morgan 8" 2 weight: http://www.troutrods.com/graphite.html

[KevinE]

My lightest rod is a 4wt 8'6 Orvis HLS2 Adams. I use it and my 5 on the streams and have never really felt the need to go lighter. Shorter: yes, lighter: no. Saying that my streams may be different to yours and it's all about horses for courses.

[KevinE]

"I think it's best to stay away from the ultra light rods -- the 1-, 2-, and 3-weights -- unless you're sure you'll be fishing at short ranges with small, unweighted flies on a day with no wind in a place where you won't catch a big fish. Tiny little rods can be a lot of fun under ideal circumstances, but in my experience, ideal circumstances are pretty rare. Of course, that's just my opinion...Most days, if you carry something like an 8- or 8 1/2-foot, 5- or 6-weight, you won't go far wrong." ~ John Gierach

"If you're spooking fish with something like an 8 foot 5 weight, a lighter line and shorter rod are probably not the answer. The answer is a longer leader and a better cast." ~ John Gierach

I wonder what he thinks about 000 rods? :D

[garthp]

My favorite small stream rod is a Gatti 2weight 9ft. THis is an awsome rod to fish with and can handle larger fish as well. I also have a #1 6'6" East branch rods as well as a 8' east branch rods #1 and then also a 7'9" LL series #2 sage.

Light rods are great for catching smaller fish, there are a few rivers in NZ that boast large pupulations of small fish and it is great to catch them on light tackle. The water is also Gin clear and the lighter lines tend not to spook them as much. In the end it all comes down to your skill at presenting a fly gently and in the right position so as not to spook the fish.

[Chris Shelton]

"I think it's best to stay away from the ultra light rods -- the 1-, 2-, and 3-weights -- unless you're sure you'll be fishing at short ranges with small, unweighted flies on a day with no wind in a place where you won't catch a big fish. Tiny little rods can be a lot of fun under ideal circumstances, but in my experience, ideal circumstances are pretty rare. Of course, that's just my opinion...Most days, if you carry something like an 8- or 8 1/2-foot, 5- or 6-weight, you won't go far wrong." ~ John Gierach

"If you're spooking fish with something like an 8 foot 5 weight, a lighter line and shorter rod are probably not the answer. The answer is a longer leader and a better cast." ~ John Gierach

I wonder what he thinks about 000 rods? :D


AMEN brother!!!

[KevinC]

I might just have to get a shorty like the Hardy Marksman for that, or the TFO Finesse. I'm surprised to hear Kevin doesn't like this rod as I thought the (rated) action would be just up his street.


Yeah I vaguely remember trying out the TFO Finesse that Darryl borrowed from Ed. It does have a medium action and like you say Grant I absolutely love a slower action, especially on the streams- it allows a much more gentle presentation. However I found that the TFO Finesse seemed to collapse on me. I was not that impressed.

However, it could have been me on the day or it could have been lined with a line that did not suit it etc etc etc. I am by no means going to say that it is a cr@p rod- chances are it was me who was not using it to its potential. However, on the day I was left a little disappointed and resultantly would not consider purchasing the rod in the future.

(In this light- I remember fishing my Greys, on its first season on the streams, with a Mainstream WF floating line and thinking that the Greys was a k@k rod! I then bought a pocketwater for it which suited it to a tee- and I've been very happy with the combo since then.)

[Arthur]

Interesting thread this - I have a 7ft 3wt Redington CPS which makes me kinda unique amongst you lot.Action is faster than the old one - I would prefer a softer action though,a sentiment many of you have stated already.

Agree with Philip - my next stream purchase will probably be a longer rod in a 4 wt.This can be used on those windy days as well as on stillwaters.

Chris I can't imagine a TFO being "too flimsy", even in 2wt guise.

[shector]

Why would you want to go for a longer rod for windy conditions? I should think that shorter rods would be ideal for this, due to its lower profile!

[dizzy]

x-cuse the pun, but different strokes for different folks!

I'd also go with a shorter rod in windy conditions.

[Chris Shelton]

(In this light- I remember fishing my Greys, on its first season on the streams, with a Mainstream WF floating line and thinking that the Greys was a k@k rod! I then bought a pocketwater for it which suited it to a tee- and I've been very happy with the combo since then.)

On that note, I agree 100% that the choice of line makes a huge difference to the performance of the rod. I think this is one of the main problems that I have with my 000 ought. The Sage 000 Quiet Taper designed for the rod has too much memory for my liking. It is fine if you dont bunch it up when retrieving, but as you know Kev, I use the fig8 most of the time for line control, and the quiet taper just does not like this kind of treatment.

[NeilRowe]

Guys

This is a strange thread in my opinion. Rods for Smallstreams? It all depends on your definition of a smallstream. There are streams in the Western Cape which are so small that a 2 wt feels like a 7wt. Here the 000 and other tiny rods in the length of 5 to 6 ft rule. Featherlight, presentations to spooky little trout are required. Average fly size would be #18 to 20 on a 7x tippet. The average casting distance would be about 3m. Streams are normally well bushed in as well. This is a typical smallstream scenario in my opinion.

A while ago I fished one of these streams with my 000 and 2 wt TXL Sage's. The 2 wt felt heavy and cumbersome whilst the 000 was magic.

On the CPS streams the bigger rods rule and the 000 would be out of place.

But for smallstreams - I would suggest that rods from 0 wt down to 000 are far superior and more fun to use.

As stated in my opening sentence - it all depends on how one defines a smallstream.

[Chris Shelton]

Chris I can't imagine a TFO being "too flimsy", even in 2wt guise.

Nor can I. If one thinks the TFO is 'flimsy' then one daren't look at a rod like the Orvis Ultrafine. Very few rods come close to the Ultrafine when it comes to 'softness', but this rod was designed for extremely delicate presentations of dry flys. It is the kind of rod you will either love or hate. I personally like a soft rod for the stream. The softer the rod, the quicker it loads....simple as that. One thing a soft rod is not designed for though is any form of weight on the end of your tippet.....even the smallest split shot will completely stuff the action up. They simply are not designed for it. As much as the Sage 000 is a specialist rod for a very specific application , so too are the softer, what I call dry fly rods.

[amfff]

On The Northern Cape Streams I use a 4W Kingfisher Malachite with a Lochmor 100 & Airflow Floating DT.

later
Francois

[Rendier]

What a read! I've got a G. Loomis Trilogy 2wt with a Ryobi 680MG, loaded with Hardy 3wt line.

[KevinC]

Nor can I. If one thinks the TFO is 'flimsy' then one daren't look at a rod like the Orvis Ultrafine. Very few rods come close to the Ultrafine when it comes to 'softness', but this rod was designed for extremely delicate presentations of dry flys. It is the kind of rod you will either love or hate. I personally like a soft rod for the stream. The softer the rod, the quicker it loads....simple as that. One thing a soft rod is not designed for though is any form of weight on the end of your tippet.....even the smallest split shot will completely stuff the action up. They simply are not designed for it. As much as the Sage 000 is a specialist rod for a very specific application , so too are the softer, what I call dry fly rods.

I personally dont agree with the statement of it being too flimsy- it just collapses- it's got less to do with the action (i.e. medium) and more to do with the general balance of the rod.

And to an extent I disagree with you Chris- my Greys (2 weight) is very slow and yet I have no problem casting split shot, heavy bead heads etc with it- it all comes down to really appreciating the slow action and then almost over exaggerating your cast in the sense that one almost casts in slow motion!

[Andre]

Neil, I didn't give you permission to use that photo of my wife you took in Plett as your avatar, she is highly peed off and says that she wants all those photos back

[NeilRowe]

Neil, I didn't give you permission to use that photo of my wife you took in Plett as your avatar, she is highly peed off and says that she wants all those photos back

Andre, I only used that photo because the other one's were a bit too risque for this "family" website. I'll gladly return this photo but the others are mine:D :D

PS. They are available at a small fee. PM me;)

[Chris Shelton]

I personally dont agree with the statement of it being too flimsy- it just collapses- it's got less to do with the action (i.e. medium) and more to do with the general balance of the rod.

And to an extent I disagree with you Chris- my Greys (2 weight) is very slow and yet I have no problem casting split shot, heavy bead heads etc with it- it all comes down to really appreciating the slow action and then almost over exaggerating your cast in the sense that one almost casts in slow motion!

I know what you are saying Kevin, but there are rods that dont like that kind of treatment and the Ultrafine is one of them. Strangely enough, my TFO seems to handle bead heads and shot ok. You should try it again sometime. I wonder if you guys were using exactly the same TFO though? I have seen others, the cheaper range with the more matt finish. Are you sure it was the 'Lefty Kreh' you guys were using? Perhaps I am such a bad caster that I wouldnt know what a 'collapse' is anyway. Please point it out to me sometime! :)

[dlampert]

I see this thread has mushroomed a bit in the couple of days I was away up in JHB. To repeat what I said originally, everyones casting style is different and different actions of rods suit different styles of casting. IMHO no style or action is better then another. If you can catch fish and enjoy fishing a particular action then as far as I am concerned that is all that counts. My point is just because a rods action suits your style of casting and you are used to fishing it, doesn't mean that it will suit everyone elses - no matter how much you recommend it. Before buying a rod go and try it out - if you like it buy it.

Getting back to the 000wt, I agree with Neil - it depends on your definition of a small stream. Any day I go fishing the streams I have at least three rods in my boot, my Ecotec Titanium 8'6" 3wt, my Vision 6'6" 2wt and my Sage 000wt. Depending on conditions when I arrive at the river, I will choose one and fish it for the day. The 000wt will cast a dry fly, a beadhead nymph and at a push even a large beadhead fritz :eek: If the wind starts blowing downstream and I battle a bit with my casting for the day - who cares - I am on the river enjoying myself. So I might not catch as many fish as I would have otherwise - shame.

Regards,
Darryl

[Chris Shelton]

welcome back Darryl.

I think everyone has got the jist of it. It was a really good debate. I must give it to Neil, he did some it up perfectly though, didnt he? :)

[Andre]

On that note, I agree 100% that the choice of line makes a huge difference to the performance of the rod. I think this is one of the main problems that I have with my 000 ought. The Sage 000 Quiet Taper designed for the rod has too much memory for my liking. It is fine if you dont bunch it up when retrieving, but as you know Kev, I use the fig8 most of the time for line control, and the quiet taper just does not like this kind of treatment.

Chris, if the line has too much memory, perhaps you should think about a reel with a larger arbour. What reel are you using.
I know that Neil had this problem with yis 000 wt line on an Abel TR light, and then changed to a Sage 3100, end of problem I understand. Perhaps Neil should comment here.

[Chris Shelton]

Chris, if the line has too much memory, perhaps you should think about a reel with a larger arbour. What reel are you using.
I know that Neil had this problem with yis 000 wt line on an Abel TR light, and then changed to a Sage 3100, end of problem I understand. Perhaps Neil should comment here.

I have the Abel TR1 but it is not so much the reel Andre, it is my retrieve. I like a line with instant memory loss when I figure 8.

876

The Sage 000 tends to bunch up a bit when I come to cast the line off my thumb. I don't find the same problem with my Orvis Springcreek for example.

[Andre]

Ok, I see the problem, firstly, you are probably fishing the pools, this is why you have so much line out, and are retrieving. Obviously, pockets and runs dont need require this form of retrieve, as you are fishing them much closer.
with your figure eight retrive, why not try dropping the line with every pass of the fingers, rather than twisting it around your fingers, this may help.
Bear in mind, I have not yet used my 000, any will reserve judgment on the line until I have had the chance to test it properly, but I understand the Sage line has very little memory properties. John at Upstream, will give you more info on this if you need it.

[gkieser]

I have been lead to believe that Sage have their lines made for them by RIO. I have a Sage DT #3 line and a Rio Pocketwater PW3 line. I also have a Cortland 333 WF #3 line. The Rio and Sage are much worse when it comes to memory, and i have had these all on the same reels. The Rio lines I have owned for any lineweight have always had the worst memory problems. With lineweights 0 and smaller you obviously have no options, but if there were options, I would take the one not produced by Rio.

[Andre]

Ja, I heared this, , there is nothing to compare it to. I would also rather not use Rio lines, but in this case we have no choice. There are a few things that can be tried, like giving it a streatch before use, lager arbour reel, etc.
As i said, I have yet to use mine, so cant comment too much at this stage

[Chris Shelton]

Ok, I see the problem, firstly, you are probably fishing the pools, this is why you have so much line out, and are retrieving. Obviously, pockets and runs dont need require this form of retrieve, as you are fishing them much closer.
with your figure eight retrive, why not try dropping the line with every pass of the fingers, rather than twisting it around your fingers, this may help.
Bear in mind, I have not yet used my 000, any will reserve judgment on the line until I have had the chance to test it properly, but I understand the Sage line has very little memory properties. John at Upstream, will give you more info on this if you need it.

I think it is time you come and fish with me to understand fully Andre :D

I use this retireve ALL THE TIME on the streams, in fast water or slow, short or long.....this is my way of staying on the move, line perfectly controlled on my hand ALL THE TIME! Nobody else that I know does this......and the one person who did is long deceased. The secret to this method, is a line with no memory.

[Andre]

I agree, I dont really understand the problem, as I very seldom have line memory problems. Perhaps because I fish the streams quite close, but whem making longer casts, also not really a problem. As soon as the streams open, we there, alternatively, we must arrange a Larkies day soon.

[Chris Shelton]

I agree, I dont really understand the problem, as I very seldom have line memory problems. Perhaps because I fish the streams quite close, but whem making longer casts, also not really a problem. As soon as the streams open, we there, alternatively, we must arrange a Larkies day soon.

Sounds great Andre, you're on!

Just back to the line control thing, I like the figure 8 because it prevents my line from ever trailing. The other method you mentioned, of dropping the coils would completely defeat the object. This method is great in that the line is always contained in my hand, allowing me to fish on the move without having to retrieve trailing line first. It also allows me to cast directly off the thumb with a simple pinch and release technique (anybody got a name for this that I should know about? :rolleyes: )

[ShaunF]

Sounds great Andre, you're on!

Just back to the line control thing, I like the figure 8 because it prevents my line from ever trailing. The other method you mentioned, of dropping the coils would completely defeat the object. This method is great in that the line is always contained in my hand, allowing me to fish on the move without having to retrieve trailing line first. It also allows me to cast directly off the thumb with a simple pinch and release technique (anybody got a name for this that I should know about? :rolleyes: )

I often use that retrieve and way of controlling line (casting straight off my hand) when fishing my floater and small nymphs. I have a Sci Angler gpx floater and it doesn't have any memory issues when doing this.

[gkieser]

Sounds great Andre, you're on!

Just back to the line control thing, I like the figure 8 because it prevents my line from ever trailing. The other method you mentioned, of dropping the coils would completely defeat the object. This method is great in that the line is always contained in my hand, allowing me to fish on the move without having to retrieve trailing line first. It also allows me to cast directly off the thumb with a simple pinch and release technique (anybody got a name for this that I should know about? :rolleyes: )

So you've lost your memory and you want it limp? Guess you're gonna have to "Thumb it in"? :rolleyes: There's a good name for it...

[Chris Shelton]

I often use that retrieve and way of controlling line (casting straight off my hand) when fishing my floater and small nymphs. I have a Sci Angler gpx floater and it doesn't have any memory issues when doing this.

Thanks for the tip Shaun. Finding a line that suits the fig8 has always been a problem for me and I'm glad to find somebody else at last who shares the same problem.