View Full Version : Otters vs Trout
We have a 20ha dam that is very regularly stocked with Rainbows.
Unfortunately, we also have a healthy population of Cape Clawless Otters (About 8). Does anyone have any evidence of otters' impact on trout populations? We also have herd of Largemouth Bass as a food source for the otters.
Otters are a protected species, so a .22 with a silencer is not really an option, how else can I get rid of these, if it is actually necessary?:confused:
Geese!
I used to work for King Fisher Trout farm as a kid, and on the farm they had some geese. Man those things were the best watch dogs ever!
Chris Shelton
26-06-07, 07:13 AM
We have a 20ha dam that is very regularly stocked with Rainbows.
Unfortunately, we also have a healthy population of Cape Clawless Otters (About 8). Does anyone have any evidence of otters' impact on trout populations? We also have herd of Largemouth Bass as a food source for the otters.
Otters are a protected species, so a .22 with a silencer is not really an option, how else can I get rid of these, if it is actually necessary?:confused:
The best way to keep them away is to surround the dam with electric fencing, but 20 ha is a bit big, it will cost you a small fortune. Eish, they could be a big problem but they are magnificent creatures. Killing them must not even feature on your options list.
Having had first hand experience with those otters .... they HAVE to become scared of people & boats. They regularly attack hooked trout ... one has even climbed into the boat after a fish! :mad:
When animals become accustomed to humans they become agressive - view the latter as a food source. (Like our damn ... I mean d**m baboons in the Cape Point Reserve).
Maybe take out the dominant male with an UNsilenced 12 gauge shotgun .... and then throw a few firecrackers every time you see one behaving aggressively.
Chris Shelton
26-06-07, 07:35 AM
Having had first hand experience with those otters .... they HAVE to become scared of people & boats. They regularly attack hooked trout ... one has even climbed into the boat after a fish! :mad:
When animals become accustomed to humans they become agressive - view the latter as a food source. (Like our damn ... I mean d**m baboons in the Cape Point Reserve).
Maybe take out the dominant male with an UNsilenced 12 gauge shotgun .... and then throw a few firecrackers every time you see one behaving aggressively.
We are not talking about Colorado here Boet! Is jy bedonnerd!? :eek: :D
Ja no look, I don't think the 12 gauge is a good idea,
but the crackers might work, no harm done!
One thing that rather concerned me is the possibility of rabies. It is common when an animal is infected its behavioural pattern changes completely (like meercats in the Eastern Cape).
These otters are REALLY aggressive - baring their (sharp) teeth when an attempt is made to scare them off without harm.
But needless to say, us fly fisher man are really privileged to see all these creatures, even if they are a big threat to us. I personally have stood next to a big puffy and it was just lying in the sun baking. Just on Saturday, I was lucky enough to see fish eagles circling above my head and you could hear there unique calls.
Fish Eagles are welcome to the odd trout - amazing what you can get away with if you have good looks and an amazing voice!:D
If anyone has contacts in the Parks Board, I have heard rumours that they will catch and relocate otters. Perhaps you can find out if this is true?
Come to think of it, we used to catch the "wild" cats in our previous residence and relocate them.
You can get the traps from the SPCA I think.
Chris Shelton
26-06-07, 10:22 AM
Fish Eagles are welcome to the odd trout - amazing what you can get away with if you have good looks and an amazing voice!:D
If anyone has contacts in the Parks Board, I have heard rumours that they will catch and relocate otters. Perhaps you can find out if this is true?
Where is your dam situated?
We are between Belfast and Dullies (Lakenvlei Forest Lodge) in Mpumalanga.
You guys get some seriously sized Otters out there, they look more like Pitbulls!
Chris Shelton
26-06-07, 10:45 AM
We are between Belfast and Dullies (Lakenvlei Forest Lodge) in Mpumalanga.
Oh ok, I thought it was in the Cape. The Cape Clawless is a lot scarcer here I guess. In 40 years on the stream, I have only ever spotted them once....and that was last year on the Smalblaar
Oh ok, I thought it was in the Cape. The Cape Clawless is a lot scarcer here I guess. In 40 years on the stream, I have only ever spotted them once....and that was last year on the Smalblaar
Gee Chris how old are you? P.S all our trout have black belts
You guys get some seriously sized Otters out there, they look more like Pitbulls!
And they behave like them! As Oom Jasper said, they have actually climbed into the boat after a trout.:eek:
If I remember correctly, Elandskloof, not far from you has a "statue" (for lack of a better word) of one. When you see the size these puppies can reach, they aren't that cute any more!
Gee Chris how old are you? P.S all our trout have black belts
Any reference to the age of members of this honourable forum is as bad as sw**ring.;)
If I remember correctly, Elandskloof, not far from you has a "statue" (for lack of a better word) of one. When you see the size these puppies can reach, they aren't that cute any more!
Quite right! I fish our dam with a can of Pepper Spray and a Glock.:D
Quite right! I fish our dam with a can of Pepper Spray and a Glock.:D
Cape clawless otters are very common up here, we even have hordes of them in Pretoria. While they will certainly eat a few trout they are a lot more fond of crabs, have a look at their scat.
If they really bother you then trap a few of them in a sherman trap and relocate them. Please leave a few behind though as they are definitely a nice addition to the scenery.
If they really bother you then trap a few of them in a sherman trap and relocate them. Please leave a few behind though as they are definitely a nice addition to the scenery.
I KNOW!! ... trap the mothers .. and release them at Mill Stream!!! .. I am sure Old MJ will appreciate the extra wildlife!!
I KNOW!! ... trap the mothers .. and release them at Mill Stream!!! .. I am sure Old MJ will appreciate the extra wildlife!!
Yeah, then you can feed them some of those Eukanuba flies the folk rave about at Mill Stream :D
Yeah, then you can feed them some of those Eukanuba flies the folk rave about at Mill Stream :D
YES .. that might work!! .. NOT debarbed flies either!! .... 20lb leader!!
Cape clawless otters are very common up here, we even have hordes of them in Pretoria. While they will certainly eat a few trout they are a lot more fond of crabs, have a look at their scat.
If they really bother you then trap a few of them in a sherman trap and relocate them. Please leave a few behind though as they are definitely a nice addition to the scenery.
Did you mean Sherman Tank?
Ours have long since eaten all the crabs and now love my trout. We stock 100kg every month and I reckon they eat half!
They would be a nice addition to the scenery anywhere that is 100km from here! :mad:
Did you mean Sherman Tank?
Ours have long since eaten all the crabs and now love my trout. We stack 100kg every month and I reckon they eat half!
They would be a nice addition to the scenery anywhere that is 100km from here! :mad:
AAAAAAAAAAH .. now I see the problem!! ... you are STACKING your trout!! ... not stocking them .. try putting your trout in the water ... at least give your otters a challenge!! :D
THAT WAS A QUICK SPELLING CORRECTION!!!!
Did you mean Sherman Tank?
Definintely meant Sherman trap - it works with bait and pressure plates and is used to trap all sort of birds, rodents, leopards etc. It is really effective. I'll chat to my brother and see if any of his mates at varsity are doing projects on otters and maybe we can work something out. Big problem would be where to release them?
Release them in my back yard ... hmmm ... think of all the flies you could tie with the fur from one pelt...
Release them in my back yard ... hmmm ... think of all the flies you could tie with the fur from one pelt...
NOW you are talking!!! .... so Mr Matuka ... maybe use the .22 instead of the 12 bore!! .. less damage to the skin!!
Definintely meant Sherman trap - it works with bait and pressure plates and is used to trap all sort of birds, rodents, leopards etc. It is really effective. I'll chat to my brother and see if any of his mates at varsity are doing projects on otters and maybe we can work something out. Big problem would be where to release them?
That would be great. Perhaps the Parks Board will take them from us, for release?
957
here you go Boet!! ... problem solved!!!
NOW you are talking!!! .... so Mr Matuka ... maybe use the .22 instead of the 12 bore!! .. less damage to the skin!!
Nah... give them a chance- shoot them on the run with dogs and a 12 bore whilst on horseback... Im sure HRH The Prince of Wales might even accept and offer to join... and maybe even Mr Thatcher, but I'd watch out for him- he'll probably bring a band of brothers and a couple grenades... just so not cricket...
chris williams
28-06-07, 11:47 AM
I like your thinking Kevin! I think it'd be a miracle though if poor old Dennis Thatcher pitched up. He died in 2003:eek: :D
I like your thinking Kevin! I think it'd be a miracle though if poor old Dennis Thatcher pitched up. He died in 2003:eek: :D
Mark Thatcher my man... the true Mr Thatcher... Executive Outcomes se moer! I'll just take over Africa by myself! ;) :D
chris williams
28-06-07, 12:02 PM
Mark Thatcher my man... the true Mr Thatcher... Executive Outcomes se moer! I'll just take over Africa by myself! ;) :D
Sorry, darlin', being an ol' wrinklie myself, I was thinking of the Old Man!!!
When you take over Africa please be kind to me and my family, we're simple, honest folk...:D
Sorry, darlin', being an ol' wrinklie myself, I was thinking of the Old Man!!!
When you take over Africa please be kind to me and my family, we're simple, honest folk...:D
ha ha ha! Sure, Ill give you a farm in Zim...
That would be great. Perhaps the Parks Board will take them from us, for release?
Sorry, looks like the varsity guys have chosen every other mamal in the country besides otters. You could still get the sherman traps from them but you'd have to operate them yourself (really easy).
Try the parks board for release sites or contact one of those wildlife rehab places and peg your otters as "problem animals"
Lardbeast
29-06-07, 03:19 PM
You can send one to me. Keep my pack on their toes and the frogs out of my pool.
here you go!!
http://www.jsflyfishing.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?item=NM-770050-0000
Lardbeast
30-06-07, 10:50 AM
http://www.otter.org/Cape%20clawless.html
Edited to add a pic of another Otter I work with...
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d132/Lardbeast/DSC00147.jpg
Now that would scare the Bejeezus out of my trout! - Not to menton the aeroplane! :D
get one of THESE!!
1039
http://www.dog-names.org.uk/otterhound.htm
Gerhard
08-02-11, 02:29 PM
While fishing last friday I saw for the 1st time an otter entering the water swimming close to the tube.
The otter did not spend a long time in the dam and the yellow bill ducks did not like him one bit...
Neat experience.
I also saw the white otter mount at Elandskloof. They do get nice and big...
Mike Taylor
08-02-11, 06:27 PM
Did you ever get to sort out the problem otters?
Ingo at Outeniqua Trout Lodge found that if he stocked with small fish, the otters weren't interested in them and by the time they had grown to prey size, they were clever enough to evade predation.
If his theory works, it would be a fairly simple solution - stock with fingerlings instead of 1Kg stockies
Did you ever get to sort out the problem otters?
Ingo at Outeniqua Trout Lodge found that if he stocked with small fish, the otters weren't interested in them and by the time they had grown to prey size, they were clever enough to evade predation.
If his theory works, it would be a fairly simple solution - stock with fingerlings instead of 1Kg stockies
Fingerlings get chowed by Cormorants.
poppernel
08-02-11, 07:24 PM
Fingerlings get chowed by Cormorants.
Thats why we shoot the ''bastards''.:D
Dave
Gerhard
08-02-11, 07:45 PM
One must expect to loose some of the fish stocked to nature be it otter, cormorants, heat, cold what ever.
I believe if you stock trout of the 500g size you will have a better chance of getting mature fish.
Mike Taylor
09-02-11, 06:44 AM
Fingerlings get chowed by Cormorants.
Ah. Didn't think of that.:o
gazzarowan
09-02-11, 09:55 AM
have you guys seen the size of the otters in the vaal river!!!those things eat the fishermen that stay late i reckon!!!
glad they not swimming around in my trout dams, would be like that crocodile attacking the tube in that river the other day!:eek::p
ArkEyes
10-02-11, 11:48 AM
Yeah Gazza, often caught fish with hefty chunks out of em.
Got some pap gooier friends that went to the vaal dam not too long ago that swear the otters stole fish out of the net without opening or breaking the net - think it was like a 4kg carp. I reckon the carp tuned bugger this boet - been here - done this - i am outta here and closing the door behind me
Gerhard
10-02-11, 11:57 AM
So how many guys here has seen otters in the trout still waters or streams while fishing or otter spoor?
They may take a couple of trout but surely the numbers are not that many to have trout population in a still water decimated by them...
I have lived in Dullstroom for 7 years in mid 80's and spend a lot of time next to the water and also after we moved away from Dullies and I have only seen my 1st otter last weekend...
gazzarowan
10-02-11, 11:58 AM
haha...i got a beaut of a yellow that was missing half her tail.
lucky for me though, cos would have never landed her without that handicap!
I have only seen my 1st otter last weekend...
When last were you at the urinal? You are a man right? Or are you a he/she/it?
poppernel
10-02-11, 06:28 PM
So how many guys here has seen otters in the trout still waters or streams while fishing or otter spoor?
They may take a couple of trout but surely the numbers are not that many to have trout population in a still water decimated by them...
I have lived in Dullstroom for 7 years in mid 80's and spend a lot of time next to the water and also after we moved away from Dullies and I have only seen my 1st otter last weekend...
Gerhard, I've seen plenty times otters on stillwaters, with most probably the most sightings at Gubu. Even our Sneeuberg waters have them. Dont know why the hype about them cleaning out fish from our waters. Their main source of diet consists of crustations, crab mainly, then any other shellfish, including snails beleive it or not. Old or injured fish will also suffice their diet, but if one takes the time and studies them and what they leave behind one will see mostly shell, with frog and very little fish in their deposits.
Give me otters anyday :)over ''jan duikers''. :eek:
poppernel
10-02-11, 06:36 PM
haha...i got a beaut of a yellow that was missing half her tail.
lucky for me though, cos would have never landed her without that handicap!
Not a otter, they go for the belly areas of old or injured fish, the rest normally they discard. Unfortunately this behaviour while a hen fish is in breeding mode can relay a stricken fish in the shallows and will/could get attacked. Those egg/ova/roe are very nutritouse (sp):) for all, even I have eaten some, yum.:p
poppernel
10-02-11, 06:38 PM
When last were you at the urinal? You are a man right? Or are you a he/she/it?
Ons praat otters, nie totters nie.:rolleyes::D
Gerhard
11-02-11, 07:15 AM
Ons praat otters, nie totters nie.:rolleyes::D
ha ha ha ha ha :D :D :D :D
Begin wonder oor ET.... :eek:
petercoetzee
11-02-11, 07:39 AM
http://www.otter.org/Cape%20clawless.html
Edited to add a pic of another Otter I work with...
http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d132/Lardbeast/DSC00147.jpg
Now i cant see this picture too clearly... but it looks to me like these otters have learnt to walk on their hind legs! and they arent ever bothered by that aeroplane. must be transporting sea food
Ons praat otters, nie totters nie.:rolleyes::D
ha ha ha ha ha :D :D :D :D
Begin wonder oor ET.... :eek:
Hey, loop speel julle twee met jul ottters....Okay:rolleyes:
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.