Fishery/Hatchery in PE area.

[fishmonger]

Howzit

I'm looking at now finally looking into operating a trout fishery and hatchery in the PE area. The bug bit while we where in the UK, and since then I've wanted to own a fishery.

My most obvious questions are:

How many people eat trout in SA? I've not seen it available anywhere

How much do you pay /kg?
How do fisheries get over the warmer climate?


There will be more.
Cheers
:)

[Gerrit Viljoen]

Howzit,

Trout is on almost every single menu in and around Dullstroom Restaurants.The place for the larnies come weekends. :D

My 300g

G

[fishmonger]

That is where you'd expect to see them on the menu, and the fat cats ordering them. I wanna know if the man in the street, without a 4 weight, eats trout.

Half of the fishery setup will be supplying fish, if there's a market, to supermarkets etc. Have to earn a living somehow, day ticket fees won't cover my ever enlarging mortgage.

[poppernel]

Howzit

I'm looking at now finally looking into operating a trout fishery and hatchery in the PE area. The bug bit while we where in the UK, and since then I've wanted to own a fishery.

My most obvious questions are:

How many people eat trout in SA? I've not seen it available anywhere

How much do you pay /kg?
How do fisheries get over the warmer climate?


There will be more.
Cheers
:)

What experience did you get in the U.K.? Fish farming I'd say is not something you can run on trial and error. Breeding or fishery licences will also be a bugger to get, thats after you find a suitable place. A overall costly venture. Be carefull!!!!!

[KevinE]

Pete, as an ex-PE man myself I'd have to say that you may struggle to find a suitable venue around PE for a commercial trout hatchery. The main problem is that you need access to a reliable supply of clean, cold water. I seem to recall a semi-commercial hatchery heading out Lady's Slipper way, have no details though. High acidity is also a problem in many of the area's streams.

But good luck man, head for the hills and see what you can find.

[Jasper]

speak to Martin Davies .. Rhodes Uni Dept Icthiology.

[nicholas]

Just out of interest,under the alien species act are the goverment allowing any new ventures that involve these species?????

[fishmonger]

I hear you Poppernel and Kevin.
Cold fresh water will be a problem and it's just hit home how important it is. I've realised I'd have to "head for the hills" to run it properly, but how does that deter my patrons?

I've been to the dept, and all I have to prove to them is that the stock will not escape into the river system.

Are there any fishery owners here and how are they finding things?

Thanks again.:D

[nicholas]

I hear you Poppernel and Kevin.
Cold fresh water will be a problem and it's just hit home how important it is. I've realised I'd have to "head for the hills" to run it properly, but how does that deter my patrons?

I've been to the dept, and all I have to prove to them is that the stock will not escape into the river system.

Are there any fishery owners here and how are they finding things?

Thanks again.:D

Ryan Weaver on the forum runs Jonkershoek here in the cape you can contac him through the forum or theres Phillip Meyer (fish on the forum)he runs Eikendal

[Byron]

You can buy trout in any just about every pick 'n pay in Gauteng, Woolworths definitely stocks it as do most decent fish mongers and supermarkets.

Prices range from about R50 upwards depending on whether you want it smoked, filleted, de-boned or whole. Go look in the fish section of your local p n p you'll be surprised.

Obviously when you are in a trout area like the Quad in Mpumalanga you can buy it everywhere, even the garage shops sell trout pies.

You also don't have to hit the larny eateries to find it on a menu.

[poppernel]

You can buy trout in any just about every pick 'n pay in Gauteng, Woolworths definitely stocks it as do most decent fish mongers and supermarkets.

Prices range from about R50 upwards depending on whether you want it smoked, filleted, de-boned or whole. Go look in the fish section of your local p n p you'll be surprised.

Obviously when you are in a trout area like the Quad in Mpumalanga you can buy it everywhere, even the garage shops sell trout pies.

You also don't have to hit the larny eateries to find it on a menu.

You are right about availability Byron, freely obtainable in the stores you mentioned here in P.E. Very pricy though, prices compare to salmon imported from Alaska etc. Filleted and deboned will cost you more or less R 165.00 kg.

As far as I know, Outenique trout lodge supplies our area.

Dave

[Byron]

You are right about availability Byron, freely obtainable in the stores you mentioned here in P.E. Very pricy though, prices compare to salmon imported from Alaska etc. Filleted and deboned will cost you more or less R 165.00 kg.

As far as I know, Outenique trout lodge supplies our area.

Dave

Damn you guys are being ripped off big time - it's much cheaper than Salmon up here.

[poppernel]

Damn you guys are being ripped off big time - it's much cheaper than Salmon up here.

:) Maybe if we had a local supplier, or competition the prices would be more realistic.

Dave

[nicholas]

I think the price of 165.00KG is for sliced smoked trout.......we buy whole trout for the restaurants and i am paying about R70.00kg

[poppernel]

I think the price of 165.00KG is for sliced smoked trout.......we buy whole trout for the restaurants and i am paying about R70.00kg

HI Nick,

And after filliting and deboning it, how much do your patrons pay per 100gr.

Dave

[nicholas]

HI Nick,

And after filliting and deboning it, how much do your patrons pay per 100gr.

Dave

We do various dishes with it a starter of smoked trout cost about R40.00 thats about 80g,maincourse salad R70.00 smoked trout 110g.

whole trout pan fried main course 300-400g fish is R95.00 the size of the fish can vary but they are more 400g than 300g.

[poppernel]

We do various dishes with it a starter of smoked trout cost about R40.00 thats about 80g,maincourse salad R70.00 smoked trout 110g.

whole trout pan fried main course 300-400g fish is R95.00 the size of the fish can vary but they are more 400g than 300g.

Starter 80g = R500 kg
Smoked m/c salad 110g = R636 KG
Whole pan trout 300-400g = R316 KG

NOT BAD. When you getting that yatch.:D :D

[Herman Jooste]

Starter 80g = R500 kg
Smoked m/c salad 110g = R636 KG
Whole pan trout 300-400g = R316 KG

NOT BAD. When you getting that yatch.:D :D

Labour to service your car R 240.00 per hour for a grease monkey that has no trade papers and is paid R 30.00/hr.
A chef who has trained, got papers, trained , got more papers, and worked his way to the top, gets paid??? I have no idea.
A plumber charges you R500.00 to just set foot on your stinking, sh!t soaked premises.
You pay over R6.00 for a litre of milk, the farmer gets R 2.50.

Welcome to the real world :eek:

[poppernel]

Labour to service your car R 240.00 per hour for a grease monkey that has no trade papers and is paid R 30.00/hr.
A chef who has trained, got papers, trained , got more papers, and worked his way to the top, gets paid??? I have no idea.
A plumber charges you R500.00 to just set foot on your stinking, sh!t soaked premises.
You pay over R6.00 for a litre of milk, the farmer gets R 2.50.

Welcome to the real world :eek:

WE are being ripped off.

:rolleyes: Now wonder what i should become, plumber
milk farmer,
chef.:cool:

[nicholas]

Starter 80g = R500 kg
Smoked m/c salad 110g = R636 KG
Whole pan trout 300-400g = R316 KG

NOT BAD. When you getting that yatch.:D :D


I wish it was that simple...............i explained in another thread about food cost of sales and was lynched.......are over heads are worked into the menu costs, wages,gas,electric,crockery,ect ect, most restaurants have a mark up of about 300% the higher your over heads the more you charge, it does not matter what the product cost, some items its more others its less........we basically buy it for R1 and sell it for R3.

Anyway the only person buyibg the Yacht are the dogs that own the company....on the salary they pay me i might buy an ark:D

[Herman Jooste]

....on the salary they pay me i might buy an ark:D

You can have mine for 4k, including paddle, anchor, pump, 20l dry bag, and one patch.:D

[nicholas]

Labour to service your car R 240.00 per hour for a grease monkey that has no trade papers and is paid R 30.00/hr.
A chef who has trained, got papers, trained , got more papers, and worked his way to the top, gets paid??? I have no idea.
A plumber charges you R500.00 to just set foot on your stinking, sh!t soaked premises.
You pay over R6.00 for a litre of milk, the farmer gets R 2.50.

Welcome to the real world :eek:

Chefs are paid badly in SA, they start at anything between R15-R20 an hour and go from there.....after they have studied for 3 years served there apprenticeship another 2 years then worked there way through a kitchen brigade or have traveled extensively for about 6-7 years and learned there trade they then can earn anything from R150-R250 an hour depending on the company they work for..

[nicholas]

Just to bring the thread back on line.........is there money in the Hatchery bussiness??? when i was at Jonkershoek recently we where told the process from hatch to selling and its a sh1t laod of work with no return for the first 4 years!!!!!!

[poppernel]

Just to bring the thread back on line.........is there money in the Hatchery bussiness??? when i was at Jonkershoek recently we where told the process from hatch to selling and its a sh1t laod of work with no return for the first 4 years!!!!!!

Nick, fish farming or hatchery guys must know there oats. So many things can go bad. Lets face it, to sell the fish is your least worries. A costly venture. Even more so , so near the coast.

[fishmonger]

OK, I get the point. You need to be earning "big ching" already to carry the full blown hatchery.

My intension still, is to operate a fishery at least and in smaller part, hatch a few of my own fish.

Now I know that these are arctic creatures and need very cool water. And this is where I need your help.
My "solutions" to issue goes as follows::p

Choose site that is springfed/runoffland.

Can be dug for the most part to 10m deep to at least have a through of cool water in drought

Surround as far as possible with trees and vegetation


Your thoughts as ever gladly appreciated.
Stywe lyne!!!!!!!!!

[Matuka]

From my limited experience, water quality is your very big concern, together with hygiene.

But cost it out carefully, including feed and cost of transporting the finished product.

All of the water in our area (Tsitsikamma) has a very high iron content and this would be a very big concern. In addition, summer temperatures have to be within limits, to restrict the water temperature.

Try to contact Wolf Avni on this site for advice. You can also speak to Tim Brewer at Katrinasrust Trout Farm in Mpumalanga, near Machadodorp. He is one of the oldest trout breeders in the country and is very helpful.

[Surly Ghillie]

Just out of interest,under the alien species act are the goverment allowing any new ventures that involve these species?????

Fishmonger, there aint no way you can warrent that fish will not escape unless you aperate a system that is entirely closed; i.e, in your basement

And that's the least of the problems.

SA trout production has been stagnant at about 1000 tons per annum for beter than 2 decades. basically 99% of this production is produced from about a dozen stable hatcheries. there are aboput another 35 hobbyists producing the remaining 1% and they come and go so fast it'll make your head spin. Even in the 'prime area', 3 out of 4 aspirant trout producers go bust. Just in Underberg, over the past 4 decades there have been about 20 trout producers, including some quite big-pocket players (i.e. Tongaat-Hulette) ... who operations have run into insovency and closed down.

The fact is there are limited sites and the 5 MOST important factors are ; position, position, position, position,position. even the 'best' locations in South frica operate in a window-of-risk that is considered 'undoable' by all major salmonid proction players overseas.

From reading your posts and your intended solutions, looks to me you are on a hiding to nothing. High tech hatcheries that rely on technology to control environment cannot compete with hatcheries that utilise nateral configurations. And in South Africa, your production cost is higher than the prices of imported product produced by facilities in Norway, Denmark, Sweden and other first world countries that subsidise aquaculture to the hilt. You can buy danish subsidised raw imports cheaper than we can produce it here. Good luck dude

[clarias]

I;m with Wolf on this one- except that aquaculture and even trout farming is gaining favour again with the state.

What I'd say you need to become a fish farmer that will swim and not sink:

-A suitable location
-Sufficient background literature and experience,as well as good consultants
-A couple of million rands for startup infrastructure,as well as enough in reserve for all the initial years in which you will not be producing due to mistakes, diseases, corrections and keeping the operation running smoothly.
-some engineering background

Good luck, and please don't go around phoning people trying to get free advice until you have done a lot of background research...

[poppernel]

I;m with Wolf on this one- except that aquaculture and even trout farming is gaining favour again with the state.

What I'd say you need to become a fish farmer that will swim and not sink:

-A suitable location
-Sufficient background literature and experience,as well as good consultants
-A couple of million rands for startup infrastructure,as well as enough in reserve for all the initial years in which you will not be producing due to mistakes, diseases, corrections and keeping the operation running smoothly.
-some engineering background

Good luck, and please don't go around phoning people trying to get free advice until you have done a lot of background research...

HI Clarias,

Maybe Fishmonger should make a point of popping into Grahamstown and meeting Martin and checking the scene out.

By the way, was hoping to meet you last week tuesday when fetching fish for stocking. Met Halfstone, good youngster that. Anyway, maybe sometime.

Dave

[clarias]

Oh, well I was still on holiday...pity I missed you guys. Yeah, Pat has been hanging around, doing odd jobs here and there, especially helping a bit with the hatchery.

Won't have much time for the forum this term- but I'll check my PMs occasionally if anyone needs anything

Cheers

[poppernel]

Oh, well I was still on holiday...pity I missed you guys. Yeah, Pat has been hanging around, doing odd jobs here and there, especially helping a bit with the hatchery.

Won't have much time for the forum this term- but I'll check my PMs occasionally if anyone needs anything

Cheers

HI Clarias,

Catch some fish during the holidays? How about a report.:D

Will let you know when i'm in G/town again, could be soon. Met Michael Petersen (Hairy Fairy Flies) in Queenstown couple of days ago and he assured me that it was only a rumour that he was not trading anymore. I'm pleased as I buy materials from him.

Dave