Synthetic Clouser Minnow

**gkieser** · 10-03-09

Originally Posted by JanK

I have also heard conflicting theories regarding the baitfish patterns:
- use a short(er) shank hook because the point is then closer to the head of the baitfish;
and
- use a long(er) shank hook because the point is then closer to the tail of the baitfish;
as both the head and the tail areas are recognised predatory "strike" areas.

I have been told that tigers hit the baitfish at the eye and our patterns that had distinct eyes were more successful than those with plain unpainted silver dumbells or no eyes, so i can believe that.

**Scythe** · 10-03-09

Something interresting we noted while standing on a platform about 15m - 25m above the water level and casting to tigers was that about 90% of the fish would spot your fly as it hits the water, give chase and turn on the take.

On a next outting a mate experimented with standard J hooks and circles and his results showed that for each cast which resulted in a take in nearly 100% of the times the circle hook resulted in a successful hookup and landing whereas for the J hooks it was only about 60%.

I'm definitely using circles for all predatory fish that are prone to a take and turn maneuvre, I think the circles will work better than J hooks.

**gkieser** · 10-03-09

Interesting that you say that Scythe. A couple of us were talking about this exact thing "not 100 miles away".

This is what I said:
I am not sure about the circle hooks and would be interested to hear if anyone has used them successfully. Two things make me sceptical of them from the experience i have had. The first one depends on my understanding on how circle hooks work. They are supposed to avoid deep hookups and lodge in the scissor of the tiger's mouth. If you look at the next picture, you will see that the tigers have a circular bony plate at the corner of their mouth.

YOu can see that nothing can lodge in the scissor effectively so i would worry about the circles working from that point of view. Another thing is that often when you get a hit from a tiger, he closes his mouth which has teeth interlocking from the top and the bottom like a crocodile. What often happens is that you go vas becuase the piano wire is locked between the teeth and the fly is actually loose inside the fish's mouth, meaning it can't actually slide into the scissor.
The second issue is the manner in which you are meant to strike the fish. They have such bony mouths that you really have to drive that hook home to get any type of solid hookup. This means strip striking as hard as you possibly can, and I have heard that if you strike with circle hooks the hook will be pulled out.

I have not got enough experience but that is just my own logic.

**JanK** · 11-03-09

Originally Posted by gkieser

I have been told that tigers hit the baitfish at the eye and our patterns that had distinct eyes were more successful than those with plain unpainted silver dumbells or no eyes, so i can believe that.

Thanks for that Grant.

I didn't mention it in my previous post, but isn't this why we put eyes on the flys in the 1st place...?

MC pointed out that leeries do a "side on" take, and therefore a long(er) shank will work better for them.

I guess then that the flies we tie do really need to be a bit more "species specific" - the research is all part of the fun!

**JanK** · 11-03-09

>> Originally Posted by gkieser
>Unholy? I just baptised it!

Originally Posted by Gerrit Viljoen

Haleluja!!!

Sharp, very sharp...

**Gerrit Viljoen** · 11-03-09

Originally Posted by JanK

>> Originally Posted by gkieser
>Unholy? I just baptised it!

Sharp, very sharp...

Amen to that bretheren

**KevinC** · 11-03-09

Grant... does this mean that I have to start tying the damn things now...? I thought that you were going to do all the tying for me...? You can have the first cast as payment.